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This article may be of interest. I am not sure how I feel about it. Personally I'd like to see the actual study.
www.cnn.com/2003/HEALTH/...ut/index.html
www.cnn.com/2003/HEALTH/...ut/index.html
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 10:56 AMi have to agree on wanting to see the study itself. in recent years there has been such an effort to quantify and equate. i am also unsure how i feel about it.
on one level it can be used to gain legal protection/rights, but then again it discounts/erases that people should be able and do change aspects of our lives that are "hard-wired"/genetic/etc.
pinning everything on nature also discounts the significance of nurture. i prefer a more messy complex interaction tween the two but that doesnt make for easy methods of differentiation and identification and ultimately surviellance and control, now does it? -
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 12:11 PMi'm in a rare mood today and this article kind of put me over the top....
Vilain states "...,we would make less mistakes in gender assignment."
this bothers me...a LOT...the fact that there has to be an assignment...and i'm going completely extreme here but DAMNIT.......
sorry i'm just blurbbing....i hope everyone checks this out, it's definitely worth reading...and i'm working on finding the journal article.... -
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 12:16 PMdo you have the journal title...its in this article on the study at the bbc...
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/1306869.stm
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 8:40 PMYah know, that irked the hell out of me too.
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 12:35 PMnot sure if this is the study from the article cuz due to the wonderful journalism there's no citations. but this one was published in 2001 with Vilain as one of the authors....
www.journals.uchicago.edu/AJHG/...1.html -
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 12:39 PMscratch all of the above this is the study for the bbc article but NOT for the one that margo referenced originally but still interesting.... -
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 4:35 PMi don't have the actual study yet but here's dr. who who's address(tee hee):
Eric J.N. Vilain
UCLA Hum Genetics
Box 957088, 6357C Gonda Cntr
Los Angeles, CA 90095-7088
phone#310-267-2455
fax#310-794-5446
i'm still searching...i may end up just calling the fellow:) -
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 4:50 PMok...here's the url to the "abstract" version of the article within the journal...it cost's $30 per article to get the entire thing or you can pay blah, blah to get the entire hard copy of the journal...but here's what i got:
www.sciencedirect.com/science
i hope that works...if not...well...go to
www.elsevier.com
search for the Molecular Brain Research Journal
as it is one of their publications. once you get there you should be able to click on the table of contents and find the article..dr.Vilain is the last author listed and phoebe dewing is the first.... -
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 4:54 PMno big surprise that url didn't work....
go the elsevier route and you should be able to find it....if not let me know and i'll work out the kinks to be sure that if you want to read it you can!
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Re: New Research
Mon, October 20, 2003 - 7:59 PMokay, damn, so many things to say bout this. First of all, whoo-fucking-hoo that it lends some 'validity' to folks whose gender identity doesn't match up with their biological sex. But, i think the bottom line is that people don't need to be validated by science. Folks is what they is, and the point is that it ain't nobodys business to tell them that they're wrong. whew, okay and secondly, just for a second, let me point out that these characteristics linked to a specific gene described as feminine or masculine are still constructions. Just because there is a correlation does not mean that it is a cause and effect relationship. And, as evolution has shown us, biology changes through generations to meet social and environmental demands. I too would like to see the study, and i would like to see someone elses research come up with similar conclusions. And, I would like to remind Dr Whatsiznuts that even men and women who feel completeley at home in their bodies to not fit into such a neat and tidy dichotimous model of gender. Oh what a world it could be if we would let children grow up organically, even the ones with 'severe malformations', and see what their bodies mean to them all on their own.
okay, I'm done ranting now.